In the past several weeks I have been watching an online back-and-forth between James White and Leighton flowers over Calvinism. Nothing new. The current debate centers on where John Calvin and Martin Luther got their ideas during the Protestant Reformation. Leighton Flowers and many folks who reject the ideas of Calvinism try to argue that the idea that salvation is outside of people's free-will choice was introduced to Christianity by Augustine and no early Christian church fathers believed in the total ability of man or God's meticulous control of reality, decreeing all that happens, before Augustine taught it. They even take it far enough to that Augustine was influenced by Gnosticism.
Of course James White disagrees and has been interacting with an interview of Ken Wilson by Leighton Flowers on his podcast and a book Ken Wilson has written on how he believes that Augustine was influenced by 4th century Gnosticism. James White is spending several hours on this because he is also explaining what Gnosticism was and reading quotes from the Church Fathers.
I think both sides are talking past each other and not really interacting. Both White and Wilson have said that they want to debate each other. I sure hope this will happen. I think they need to agree on definitions including on what James White and Ken Wilson believe about what Calvinism and what Provisionism are and what they believe before they really get down to the fundamental questions that their disagreement raises: "Was Augustine the first to introduce the ideas, regarding Human free-will, that gave rise to Calvinism?"
Here are two videos that really sum up Ken Wilson's arguments.
James White has not finished his arguments but he has presented evidence that some Church Fathers did affirm God's sovereign control over everything. Here is an example from White's webcast.
I don't think James White has answered Wilson's thesis yet, but I do appreciate White going through all this history and thought I have not been exposed. I sure hope he will answer the video where Flowers and Wilson speak to White's critiques directly.
Here are some questions that I want answered in the debate between White and Wilson:
What is "predestination"?
What is "free libertarian will? Is it autonomous?
Was the a single early Christian author agree with libertarian free-will?
Is there anything "good" in me or you apart from God?"
How do we know what "good" is?
Does God control human will?
Has God ever controlled human will or just responded to it?
Is there a difference between the New Testament and the Church Fathers use terms like "Boulimai" and "Thelo"?
Here are some questions that I want answered in the debate between White and Wilson:
What is "predestination"?
What is "free libertarian will? Is it autonomous?
Was the a single early Christian author agree with libertarian free-will?
Is there anything "good" in me or you apart from God?"
How do we know what "good" is?
Does God control human will?
Has God ever controlled human will or just responded to it?
Is there a difference between the New Testament and the Church Fathers use terms like "Boulimai" and "Thelo"?