Islam and Christianity A Common Word: "Ex Muslim" Dr. Ergun Caner accepts James White's challenge...

Here is another great post from  Islam and Christianity A Common Word. It's again concerning the dispute between James White and Ergun Caner. My remarks will be in red.The blogger seems to spend time criticizing White.

Bismillah ir rahman ir raheem
As salamu 'alikum wr wb
(May the Peace,Mercy of Allah and Blessings be upon you)


"Ex Muslim” Dr. Ergun Caner accepts James White's challenge... Help from Peter Lumpkins

Tom Ascol and James White may have exposed Ergun Caner as an 'ex fake Muslim' but Dr. Caner is not ready to resign from Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary yet!

There are several stages to Ergun Caner's response and attack upon James White.

Ergun Caner's personal attack could consist of many things.

Considering the true things that White has been able to bring up against Caner, the only Christian response he could possibly make is to humbly repent for the errors. Doesn't seem he's going to take that option.

These are some of the things Ergun Caner may bring up in retaliation against James White.

The first of which is personal. Many people do not know about James White's troubled past. The fact that his sister has left Calvinism for Catholicism.

Um, how does the decisions his sister makes have anything to do with James White's ministry or salvation or with vindicating Caner? Let me help you. It doesn't

Please see here:http://thegrandverbalizer19.blogspot.com/2009/11/apologist-james-white-denies-doctrine.html

The fact that James White does not wish to discuss his father's molestation of his sister; and the extremely unloving attitude that James White has shown his sister. Please see here: http://thegrandverbalizer19.blogspot.com/2009/11/apologist-james-white-cold-attitude.html

Um, how does the pain in the White family have anything to do with defending Caner. And if James White has not publicly spoken about his sister's accusations, how does that lessen the value of his work or person. You don't know what he has or has not done for his sister. I am not convinced by her letter because when I read the part where she said had she been raised catholic she would have known to call the police I have to wonder about all the child abuse by catholic clergy? Were they taught to call the police if a parent abused them but accept it if a priest does it? I don't think so. The bottom line is that we don't know what happened and it's none of my or anyone outside of their family's business either!

Ergun Caner's personal attack of James White could consist of questioning his academic background.

There could even be a declaration signed by all disputing factions that no person will be taken seriously in the realm or area of debate until their degrees and qualifications can be taken as credible by the U.S department of education. This could see several debators and apologist most notably James White taken out of the debate arena completely!

What would happen in this scenario is that in general Catholics, Baptist, Mormons, and other demoninations and factions would not debate James White anymore until he got his education first.

The part of this post floored me. What proof does the blogger have that James White does not really have a good doctorate? How is his education is not up to snuff? Just because you disagree with me does not make you uneducated. It's a fallicious statement atheists use against theists all the time. The blogger offers no proof that James White is academically challenged.

Ergun Caner's could point out that James White is moving away from the once saved always saved position. Please see here:http://thegrandverbalizer19.blogspot.com/2009/11/apologist-james-white-denies-doctrine.html

I read the blogger's "proof" and I disagree. Eternal security is one of the 5 main points of Calvinism. And I have never heard a Calvinists deny that people leave the faith and become apostates but this means that they were never part - they were never of the elect. 

Ergun Caner could further point out that James White is slowly moving away from the Biblical Innerancy issue.Please see here: http://thegrandverbalizer19.blogspot.com/2010/01/james-white-backs-away-from-biblical.html

The blogger at this point actually points to a previous post that I myself also blogged months ago. However he got a totally different understanding of what White actually said. He makes the error all Muslim apologists make in  assuming that Christians mean the same thing they do when we say a scripture is inerrant. The Muslim view of inerrancy seems to be more akin to the King James Only proponents. Therefore rather than try to correct all the errors here, I suggest the blogger and all who are interested read The King James Only Controversy by James White. It tells how the Bible was transmitted to us today and why we can trust it to be true. 

Personally I think if I were a Christian I would stick with William Lane Craig, Mike Licona, Norman Geisler and the like. If I were a Christian I would be suspicious of both James White and of Ergun Caner!

After reading a few posts, the blogger does not like James White! I can tell. He does not like Calvinism either. I listen to and enjoy William Lane Craig, Mike Licona, and Norman Geisler. However Christians follow Jesus no one else. Suggesting otherwise is like if I accused the blogger of following Muhammad not Allah. I wonder if the blogger ever looked at what Geisler think of Islam? He throws it into much the same categories as Calvinism. http://mmcelhaney.blogspot.com/2009/05/predestination-in-islam-dr-norman.html

It seems that those who are attacking the credentials of Ergun Caner are not looking into James White self proclaimed 'doctorate' and rather or not he should be called 'Dr' White. Also people may refuse to debate James White in the future as apologist should only want to debate people who have the education and academic profile and not just an ability to speak infront of crowds.

Let us be frank: to be able to speak in front of crowds about high level, technical subjects against "experts" and win, means that you have the education and academic profile. I still would like to see proof for why the blogger would call White's doctorate into question because none is provided. But he beats those who do have doctorates. Does that mean we should call his opponents into question too?

So Peter Lumpkins has called out the James Whiteophites on their inconsistencies when attacking Ergun Caner.

As Peter Lumpkins has pointed out see here:

http://peterlumpkins.typepad.com/peter_lumpkins/2010/02/dissing-dr-ergun-caner-the-monotonous-mission-of-tom-ascol-and-james-white.html#more

Stay tuned .... will keep you posted (literally) Allah-willing. 

 I looked that Lumpkin's arguments. I had laugh so I would not cry. They are none arguments. They basically amount to: "So what if Caner misrepresented himself as debating good Muslim apologists? You're a stinkin' Calvinist. I never liked you anyway." Great way to win a debate.

Islam and Christianity A Common Word: “Ex Muslim� Dr. Ergun Caner accepts James White's challenge...