thegrandverbalizer is amazing to me. On one hand he decries the way Christians misrepresent Islam and give misleading information about what Muslims believe. He's right about that. It happens a lot. However he does the same things regarding Christianity. It's just as bad.
This is actually quite sad to hear about this. However, once again why are we not shocked? We are not shocked because Christians and in particular Protestants are in the news because of their rejection of central leadership that can guide them in their interpretation of the
Bible.
It's really no more shocking than when we hear about a Muslim suicide bomber in Israel or Afghanistan. Or how a young girl can be raped by her cousin and die from being lashed for adultery. Or how about chopping off the right hand of thieves? Or what suggesting that it is women's responsibility to act and dress in ways that don't tempt men to rape them because they have such poor self control? Or how about marrying a 10 year-old girl? Are these acts and situations indicative of what it means to be a Muslim? Are these examples of fringe nut jobs who are not following what Islam truly is or are they really living up to what Islam is?
I am a Protestant and I do not reject the central authority of scripture. I believe that the Bible is clear enough and a revelation from our creator to understand His nature and His will for our lives. What central authority do Muslims have so that they can get the "correct" interpretation of their scriptures and pick through their textual variants? Whatever or whoever that central authority is doesn't seem to be working, given that Muslims can't seem to decide what "Jihad" is supposed to be in the world today and whether or not they should tolerate us or kill us.Just who does thegrandverbalizer thinks should be ultimate Christian authority and why?
Because
Protestant Christianity is the ultimate Pandora's box. The thousands of Protestant Christian sects are free to use individual hermeneutic, interpretation, and understanding of the scriptures to understand the Bible.
As long as Islam has sects that outright contradict each other on life/death issues, I see no reason why Islam is not a "Pandora's box:" filled with whatever you want to fill it with. As for Christianity, just because people can claim to be Christians, yet totally ignore what the Bible says does not mean that we free to use whatever hermeneutic or interpretation we fancy. Either the Bible supports us or we are in outright rebellion against
God and we need to realign ourselves with God. The Bible is right and all of us are wrong and a great many things (some more than others)?
You see because they believe that the
Holy Spirit will guide them into all truth (not necessarily the Bible). To some degree even though the Protestants claim to rely upon the Bible the problem is in the fact that many things in the Bible are nuanced or subject to a great range and deal of interpretation.
Believers who believe that the Bible is the word of God know that the Bible is all truth and that we cannot seriously think that the Holy Spirit will lead us in anyway contrary to it. Therefore we know when we are hearing the Holy Spirit and when it's us or Satan. I also loved how thegrandverbalizer writes "the problem is in the fact that many things in the Bible are nuanced or subject to a great range and deal of interpretation" as if his description does not better describe the Qur'an. I sure would like to see an example of a single "nuanced" passage in the Bible "subject to a great rand and deal of interpretation."
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. (John 16:13)
So as we can see if you believe that you have the Holy Spirit (and there is no way to really tell) and Christians such as John MacArthur have failed to give legitimate litmus test. So Protestant Christianity contains with in it the seeds of it's own destruction.
We don't need John MacArthur to give us a litmus test to know if you have the Holy Spirit. The Bible gives it to us. For example, again that the Holy Spirit would never lead you in a way contrary to what the Bible says given that the Bible is the Word of God and God does not lie or change His mind. Let's not forget that some Muslims try to twist Jesus' words to says that He is speaking of Muhammad not the Holy Spirit. Just who is using a strange hermeneutic? In addition.
13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.
16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 2324 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.-Galatians 5:13-16 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
This of course is the sovereign will of the Creator. They have rejected truth and the Creator has let them to wallow in their own darkness. The thousands of Protestant sects will eventually wear one another down.
I wonder how many of these various denominations have thegrandverbalizer studies and compared to one another. I've visited many other Christian churches who belong outside of my denominations and read about several of them about what they believe and what they practice. Yes there are stark differences in many of them but very few are so different and so alien that I can't worship with them or find common ground. What groups do thegrandverbalizer consider are mutually exclusive and why? He gave no examples.
So this brings us to this particular Mennonite Christian sect which goes back to the Protestant Reformation.
So here you have it a man who no doubt believes that the world outside has no business to tell him what he believes would be a Biblical and justified punishment for his 21 year old son goes and locks his son in a box for 2 months!
Given that the son was a 21 year-old adult, I think that a better way to punish him would have to kicked him out of the house and tell him to fend for himself if he would not submit to the authority of his parents - not to lock him in a box for 2 months. Notice what thegrandverbalizer is doing. He is trying to equate locking the man in the box as the same as corporal punishment. It is not the same at all.
Of course the Bible says it's o.k to beat your children (male and female) with a rod!
Yes, it does. And I thank God for a mother and father who didn't just let me act any kind of way and whipped me when I rebelled. This is why I'm not in jail or dead now. I thought that Muslims believe the same thing,,,oops...I got confused...a husband can lightly beat his wife if she disobeys him just not in face.
The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers. And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. (Luke 12:46-48)
Yup! And? Jesus was talking about servants not children.
If thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire (Matthew 18:8-9)
Of course our Christian friends who under the influence of more benign liberal influence will say this means spiritual hands and spiritual feet!
Sure I bet Jesus is saying cut off one of your spiritual feet and one of your spiritual hands, because it's better to go through life with one spiritual hand or one spiritual foot than two! When will these people come clean!
If Thegrandverbalizer wants to take this passage literally that if your hand or foot causes you to sin, you should cut it off, that's fine, but I think he's missing the point Jesus is making. I would not say that Jesus is just talking about spiritual hands and feet. Jesus is referring to ANYTHING that causes you to sin and blocks you from God. Again the passage is not about beating Children or locking them in a box.
Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell. (Proverbs 23:13-14)
Ever heard the saying, "I'll beat the hell out of you" So now you got it!
And it works too. I'm living proof of it. It's referring to not just avenging a wrong a child does. It's referring to correcting and training a child so they not only know what to and what not to do but also why. This will teach a child to reverence and obey God - keeping you out of hell. I'd think most traditional Muslims would agree with this.
He that spareth his rod hates his son: but he that loves him chasteneth him betimes.(Proverbs 13:24)
I agree. My parents whipped me and showed me right from wrong so that I wouldn't go out and act like a fool and become a danger to society and end up getting shot. I thank God for them.
So here you have yet another Protestant Christian (Holy Spirit filled nonetheless) dishing out extreme punishment to his son!
So what else does the Bible say about how to chastise and correct Children? Here is a fundamental truth: the way we see God is influenced by the relationship we have with our fathers. Look at this parallel:
8 If you are not disciplined—and everyone undergoes discipline—then you are not legitimate, not true sons and daughters at all. 9 Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live! 10 They disciplined us for a little while as they thought best; but God disciplines us for our good, in order that we may share in his holiness. - Hebrews 12-8-10
There is much in the Bible on this subject and what I would have loved to have seen is a single Biblical passage that could be used to show that a father has the right to lock his son in a box for 2 months. Instead we have a scripture that says:
4 Fathers, do not exasperate your children; instead, bring them up in the training and instruction of the Lord.- Ephesian 6:4
Surely no one can disagree with that. Sometimes that means handing out whipping when appropriate.
