Fistbump of the day - Answering Muslims: Muslim Debate Tricks

David Wood has posted a list compiled by Yohannes that lists tactics Muslims use to win debates. The real interesting thing is that I've noticed some similar tactics Atheists use, only when Atheists use them they are even more pathetic. They have less to stand on. I've annotated the list in red.

In the comments section, Yohannes posted ten rules of Muslim debate. Since we see these tricks being implemented again and again, they deserve special attention.

WINNING DEBATES FOR DUMMIES: A Guide for Muslims to Win Debates with Ten Easy Tricks

1. Always keep your CAPS Lock on. This way your post will be difficult to read and no one will be able to answer.

Most Atheists I have tried to reason with tend to use all caps when shouting as most people.

2. Whenever someone comes up with a verse from the Quran that you are unable to defend, say that it is taken out of CONTEXT.

When you raise a verse from the Bible that the Atheist has butchered or just plain wrong about, the Atheists I've talked to tell you that it's wrong to use the Bible to prove the Bible. Smoke screen. Funny how some Muslims do the same thing when they fail to represent what the Bible says accurately.

3. Whenever someone comes up with a Hadith that you are unable to answer, say that Hadiths are not reliable.

Atheists do the same thing with scientists and scholars who disagree with them. Classic.

4. When someone comes to you with both the Quran and the Hadith, say that the Quran and the Hadith can only be understood in Arabic.

Here atheists claim that the Bible and Christian theology is so fragmented it's impossible to tell what interpretation is correct...except theirs.

5. When someone comes to you with the Quran and the Hadith and also proves that he/she understands Arabic, say that these verses are for a specific time period and could not be applied today.

Atheists ignore all the history and time Christianity has been around as if the arguments they trot out have never been answered or thought about. It's been 2000 years and longer for Judaism. They like to pretend the Bible is antiquated. I'm willing to accept that verses in the Qur'an can be for a specific time period and not applied today, because the same it true for the Bible. But there is a major difference. When the Bible contains commands for killing the Amalekites it was for the Jews at the time in the context of war and can't be followed today. When was the last time you met an Amalekite? Amorite? Exactly. There are not any. But when the Qur'an calls the killing for non-Muslims where does it stop? When either they convert or die.

6. When you cannot answer any questions, say that Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world and soon the entire world will believe.

I guess they mean the whole world will be Muslim after they kill everyone else who doesn't convert. Atheists are under the delusion that eventually they will be able to prove that there is no God and people will "grow" out of being religious. What they fail to understand is that a born-again Christian doesn't believe the Bible and in God because it makes them feel good. We believe because we know it's true.

7. When someone comes up with proofs that Islam is not the fastest growing religion, say that these figures are biased and compiled by Christians.

I've heard atheist say the same thing when they aren't complaining about being too few.

8. Paste some YouTube videos about the Quran's scientific miracles. When someone proves that these videos are stupid, shout that they are biased.

Atheists do the same thing only opposite. They try to debunk and disprove Christianity - failing miserably - but what else can they do.

9. Keep on pasting random verses from the Qur'an to divert attention.

Atheists accuse Christians of doing the same thing, only they think a single word from the Bible is irrelevant because they don't think it's probably true (although they can't prove that it's not true).

10. Finally, when you are totally on the run, curse and threaten people with Hell fire and say that they are not worthy of Islam.

This one Atheists and Muslims definitely have in common - profanity included.

Answering Muslims: Muslim Debate Tricks

FacePlant - Debunking Christianity: When Christians Criticize Each Other I Think They're All Right

John Loftus does not understand  Christian Theology. He even admits it. 

One way to tell whether a theory is in crisis to to observe how many versions of that theory have been proposed. When it comes to how the death of Jesus supposedly atones for sins there have been a lot of versions proposed by Christians who, for good reasons, have disputed the others.

Loftus is suggesting that Christians have varied and different viewpoints on how Jesus atones for those who put their faith in Him.

So let's recap. The earliest proposals were The Ransom Theory and the The Recapitulation Theory. Then came a host of them afterward, like Anslem's Satisfaction Theory, The Penal Substitutionary Theory, The Governmental Theory, The Moral Influence Theory, and recently The Relationship Theory. There are others: The Acceptance Theory. The Declaratory Theory. The Mystical Theory. The Guaranty Theory. The Vicarious Repentance Theory. The Christus Victor Theory. The Healing Theory. The Penal Non-Substitution Theory. The Kaleidoscope Theory. The Participatory Model. The Scapegoating Theory.

Loftus posts a laundry list of theologies regarding the atonement. The faceplant is that many of them are not contradictory of mutually exclusive at all. For example there is no conflict between Penal Substitution and the Scapgoating theory.  Hear that? That is the sound of a face slamming concrete - our propitiation.  If you wanna know how Jesus atones for our sin and what does it mean for Him to be our sin offering, read Hebrews and the rest of the New Testament.

Check some of them out! See also this book of four views, and watch as Christians trash the other views! You see, there is nothing left for me to do. Christians do it to themselves. All I need to do is point it out.

So not all Christians agree with each other. So what? Not all atheists agree with John Loftus, does not mean Atheism is wrong? Atheism is wrong, but not for the reason that Loftus is wrong or that other Atheists disagree with him.

Given nearly two millennia I’d venture to say with good reason that there will never be a cogent, well-argued version that can ever pass muster in the future either.

Oh, I get it: In his mind there are no cogent or well-argued understanding of how the Atonement works. .  

I think the whole idea of Jesus dying for my sins to restore me to God is built upon the beliefs of a superstitious ancient world, where gods and goddesses were pleased with sacrifices, whether they were human or animal ones.

 John Loftus is entitled to his opinion no matter how wrong it is. Loftus doesn't offer any evidence for that conclusion in this post, but that's what a faceplant looks like.

This ancient world is long gone now, so it’s time to give up believing in an incarnate God who offered a sacrifice for us on the cross to atone for our sins.

Here is the problem: what are you going to do about your sins?  If Jesus is not your propitiation then who is?  Yourself?  Problem is no one can pay for their own sin.  Loftus is one of those who decry the existence of evil and suffering. He believes that if there really was a God, He would get rid of such things if God was good. But I'm shocked that people don't stop to think "What happens to me, if God did exist and decided to get rid of all the evil in existence?" To most of us "evil" is the person over there doing things to other people that I would never do. That's not it. We have all sinned. None of us live up to the standards we set for ourselves about what is moral - right and wrong - completely and consistently every day. Why would anyone think that we should get away with that. We all agree that the one who rapes and murders a little child should be punished. Some even think they should be put to death - especially if it's their child. But what about when we lie on someone. Or steal an idea from someone as if it's our own? Bootleg a movie or a song? Cheat on taxes? Lust on a person who is not your spouse? Speeding when you aren't supposed to? These are wrong too and demand punishment. And some of these don't even seem like they should be an offense to us. That is why we have the Bible, it reveals sin to us that we don't already know about through our consciences. How do you pay what you owe to God because of your inability to live up to the standard of which he has set?  News Flash: you can't. 

When you stand before God to give an account for your life, how are you going to explain - given your obvious wretchedness - why God should not send you to the hell you have chosen to go? Waiting. Take your time.

Debunking Christianity: When Christians Criticize Each Other I Think They're All Right