Several Weeks ago Dr Paul Copan was on Unbelievable? and it was an interesdting dialogue between him and Dr Norman Bacrac. I've posted a followup on the encounter, but I don't think I posted this article where Madeline Flannagan puts a link to the discussion and comments on it. The discussion was on Paul Copan's book
Is God a Moral Monster? - n which the events of the Old Testament is recounted for us are discussed and an aplogetic is offered to counter claims of genocide against God. Take a look at the article and listen to the program if you missed it.
Unbelievable? Is God a Moral Monster? Paul Copan & Norman Bacrac | MandM
Personal blog that will cover my personal interests. I write about Christian Theology and Apologetics, politics, culture, science, and literature.
Wednesday, June 8, 2011
Peregrinations: Dinosaurs and the Age of the Earth
Rick Gerhardt posted an interesting video on what the Bible has to say on the age of the Earth and dinosaurs. I think science has adequately shown that the earth is quite a bit older than 6K years. However that does not imply that macro evolution is true. The bible does not give us enough information to set dates for the beginning or the end.
Dinosaurs and the Age of the Earth from :redux on Vimeo.
Peregrinations: Dinosaurs and the Age of the Earth
Peregrinations: Dinosaurs and the Age of the Earth
Related articles
- "Mega Dinosaurs" take Manhattan in new exhibit (travelnews.britishairways.com)
- The Age of the Earth According to People on the Street [Video] (geeksaresexy.net)
- Paleontologist attempting to turn chickens into dinosaurs (dvice.com)
- Why would a meteorologist use meteorites and lunar rocks to find out the age of the earth (wiki.answers.com)
- Could dinosaurs and humans live together (wiki.answers.com)
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FacePalm of the Day #87 - Debunking Christianity: I Do Believe, I Do Believe ( Wizard of Oz)
Yet another post has gone up Debunking Christianity from TGBaker and yet another FacePalm. Instead of more eisogesis and scripture twisting, this time he opts for bare assertion without any shred of substantiation. Let's look at his post carefully:
I do agree that such theology is dysfunctional because it's not based on what the Bible teaches...that makes it worthy of disregard not sophisticated. It's at the end of this that TGBaker misses the fundamental point that the Bible does offer real answers for living and it is based on evidence and facts. I say this without offering proof since TGBaker did not offer any. I can make assertions too. If anyone would like to discuss the reasons why we can trust the Bible is true, I'd more than welcome it.
Debunking Christianity: I Do Believe, I Do Believe ( Wizard of Oz)
It's sad and dangerous that people continue to fall for myths of Christianity. What is worse is the intentional affirmation and legitimating of these myths as absolute truths that are an imposition upon the activities of humankind. In seminary when I was a theological neophyte there was a worse myth. The neo-orthodoxy of World War I evolved into a theology that would make truth claims that the bible IS a collection of myth and fable as a positive thing.
Presupposition: Where is TGBaker's proof that Christianity is a myth? This is important. If he's right about the Bible being full of myths, then he has a leg to stand on, yet he offers nothing but an assertion.
BUT these myths and narratives are the way that god truly reveals himself in time. They are the revelation of truth in narrative. The virgin birth was not historical but it was more truthful than fact in that it revealed Jesus as both god and man. The resurrection was not historical because the transcendent intersected at that point in history whereby god manifested in the story. In other words the body stayed dead but the spirit of Jesus spread through the world in the mythic story. Die Sache Jesu geht Weider... The cause of Jesus lives on. (Willi Marxen ) Jesus rose into his on kerygma (gospel or preaching) Rudolf Bultmann, the resurrection occurred as revelation at communion after Jesus's death as disciples began to understand the meaning of the bread and wine Rudolf Schnackenburg (Catholic).
The above paragraphs illustrates where modern "Christianity" often falls off the wagon and the wheels of their wagon fall off. Where is TGBaker's proof that there was no virgin birth or resurrection? How does he know that these were not historical events? He says nothing but asserts it. I understand that TGBaker is merely descsribing "neo-orthodoxy" but I do not recognize my understanding of history or scripture in this at all. People who think this way cannot be truly born-again Christians according to what the Bible says a Christian believes.
These examples show why it is important to end the dysfunctional systems of these types of Christianity, Judaism or Islam. There is nothing sophisticated about such theologies. They actually reflect a desperation to cling to the security of a past life of delusional answers concerning questions about living rather than to face the responsibility of finding the real answers in living itself. The problem we face, however, is as my examples demonstrates, the intent to believe regardless of the facts.
Presupposition: Where is TGBaker's proof that Christianity is a myth? This is important. If he's right about the Bible being full of myths, then he has a leg to stand on, yet he offers nothing but an assertion.
BUT these myths and narratives are the way that god truly reveals himself in time. They are the revelation of truth in narrative. The virgin birth was not historical but it was more truthful than fact in that it revealed Jesus as both god and man. The resurrection was not historical because the transcendent intersected at that point in history whereby god manifested in the story. In other words the body stayed dead but the spirit of Jesus spread through the world in the mythic story. Die Sache Jesu geht Weider... The cause of Jesus lives on. (Willi Marxen ) Jesus rose into his on kerygma (gospel or preaching) Rudolf Bultmann, the resurrection occurred as revelation at communion after Jesus's death as disciples began to understand the meaning of the bread and wine Rudolf Schnackenburg (Catholic).
The above paragraphs illustrates where modern "Christianity" often falls off the wagon and the wheels of their wagon fall off. Where is TGBaker's proof that there was no virgin birth or resurrection? How does he know that these were not historical events? He says nothing but asserts it. I understand that TGBaker is merely descsribing "neo-orthodoxy" but I do not recognize my understanding of history or scripture in this at all. People who think this way cannot be truly born-again Christians according to what the Bible says a Christian believes.
These examples show why it is important to end the dysfunctional systems of these types of Christianity, Judaism or Islam. There is nothing sophisticated about such theologies. They actually reflect a desperation to cling to the security of a past life of delusional answers concerning questions about living rather than to face the responsibility of finding the real answers in living itself. The problem we face, however, is as my examples demonstrates, the intent to believe regardless of the facts.
I do agree that such theology is dysfunctional because it's not based on what the Bible teaches...that makes it worthy of disregard not sophisticated. It's at the end of this that TGBaker misses the fundamental point that the Bible does offer real answers for living and it is based on evidence and facts. I say this without offering proof since TGBaker did not offer any. I can make assertions too. If anyone would like to discuss the reasons why we can trust the Bible is true, I'd more than welcome it.
Debunking Christianity: I Do Believe, I Do Believe ( Wizard of Oz)
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Tuesday, June 7, 2011
More Facts on the Myth of “The Palestinian People” - Voice of Revolution
Dr Michael Brown has written an interesting article regarding two myths about the Palestinian People. Read it at the link below.
More Facts on the Myth of “The Palestinian People” - Voice of Revolution
More Facts on the Myth of “The Palestinian People” - Voice of Revolution
Related articles
- The Zionists Think Palestinian Statehood Is a Big Joke (desertpeace.wordpress.com)
- The Palestinian Move (middleeastatemporal.wordpress.com)
- Israel-Palestinian Conflict is in the eye of the beholder - Ha'aretz (news.google.com)
Answering Muslims: Muslim Lecturer Abdur Raheem Green Declares: "Terrorism Works"
There really is a double standard in America. Recently David Wood wrote:
I think there is a serious problem with this!
Answering Muslims: Muslim Lecturer Abdur Raheem Green Declares: "Terrorism Works"
So when a Muslim says, "According to Islam, we are in a permanent state of war with those who oppose Islam," it's perfectly acceptable. But when I say, "According to Islam, Muslims are in a permanent state of war with those who oppose Islam," I'm a racist, Islamophobic, hate-mongering bigot.
I think there is a serious problem with this!
Answering Muslims: Muslim Lecturer Abdur Raheem Green Declares: "Terrorism Works"
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Manuscript Evidence.pdf (application/pdf Object)
Here is a very handy little chart
Manuscript Evidence.pdf (application/pdf Object)
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FacePalm of the Day #86 - Debunking Christianity: Jesus Was Baptized for His Sins
I've noticed quite a few posts on Debunking Christianity from TGBaker. I guess John Loftus needs help eisogeting scripture. It really pains me to see scripture abused in this way, based on some unfounded presuppositions. I've annotated one of these posts with my comments in red font.
I would like to present an atheistic bible study, an observation or interpretation, I believe explains the re-working of the original story of Jesus and John the Baptist by the authors of Matthew and Luke. This is with the understanding that Matthew and Luke use Mark in their compositions. In Mark Jesus is baptized into ( eis) the remission of sins. The preposition “eis” means from out of a state to into a different state or place. This preposition in Mark is redacted (re-worked or edited) by Matthew.
Can you really get out of these passages what TGBaker says you can. I don't think so.
The statement of what the baptism is for in Matthew is dropped. We see the term "into the remission of sins' added instead by Matthew to the pericope of the Last Supper. 26:28. There communion becomes for the remission of sin. Matthew creates a conversation where John the Baptist tries to prevent Jesus from being baptized and Jesus tells him to go on with it to fulfill all righteousness.
I would like to know which manuscripts TGBaker is getting this from. The Phrase "into the remission of sins" is not in Mark 1:9.. And none of the canonical Gospels show Jesus getting baptized more than once. In addition I see fundamental mistake here in that neither Communion nor Baptism save you or takes away your sins. These are only symbolic of the work God does in the hearts and minds of His people. There is not a single passage in the Bible that make salvation contingent on Communion or Baptism. Also I see a lot of "poisoning the well" here. Why would TGBaker insinuate that Matthew manufactures the conversation between Jesus and John the Baptist? Why couldn't Matthew just have a detail that Mark does not? TGBaker has presumptions that the texts cannot be reliable and he spins his interpretation in what ever way he has to validate those assumptions.
This answers the problem of why a sinless person would need baptism as in Mark and also makes John subservient to Jesus. This makes obvious the church is dealing with the fact that Jesus was a follower of John the Baptist and does not begin his ministry until John is arrested. The author of the Gospel of John will have Jesus baptizing and ministering at the same time as the Baptist and does not have Jesus baptized by John.
Another presumptions offered with no proof of any kind. There is the theory going around that Jesus was one of John the Baptist's followers, but no proof is ever seeming given beyond raising the speculation. John and Mark are not in conflict because John does not say that Jesus was not baptized by John the Baptist.all. Mark said that Jesus went into Galilee after John was arrested not that he did no ministry before John the Baptist was arrested. Sure wish people would not read things into the Bible that is not there.
In Mark Jesus comes up out of the water and the Holy Spirit comes into ( again eis) him. Matthew changes this to the spirit descends upon ( epi) him. The idea of the spirit after baptism coming into a person is consistent with the idea in Acts 2:38: Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Again the message was not that Baptism was the prerequisite for forgiveness of sin. Baptism is a sign of repentance. I sure would like to know what translation this guy is using because I can't find an English translation that agrees with him.
In Mark Jesus alone hears god saying that he is well pleased. In Matthew god addresses his pleasure to the crowds. Luke maintains Mark's terminology about baptism, changes the adoptionistic reception of the Spirit into Jesus to a confirmation like Matthew to the spirit as dove comes down upon (epi) him. The change of the preposition by Matthew and Luke are intentional because of the theological implications and the addition of the infancy narratives wherein Jesus has the spirit from birth! Luke quotes mark and maintains gods announcement of pleasure to Jesus.
Um, Luke did not say that Jesus has the spirit from Birth. It says that John the Baptist did. Just because Mark does not have the detail that other people heard the voice and understood the sign at Jesus' baptism does not mean the Luke made it up. Notice that Mark does not say that only Jesus saw the dove and heard the voice. The voice was for the crowd's benefit not Jesus' benefit.
When one looks at the quoted OT verses in Mark 1:2f they are combined and perhaps reflect a pre-exiting proof text designed from Isaiah and Malachi not just Isaiah as stated. The pronouns are changed so that the verses can apply to the idea of the Baptist as precursor. Instead of "Behold I send my messenger before your face the original in Malachi 3:1 reads "I will send my messenger before me ( i.e.; God)." The change is from god talking to his prophet about his own coming to god talking to Christ about sending the Baptist before him. The messenger in Malachi was originally the Messiah and not the Baptist. The change is from god to messiah or Jesus in doing so and an example of a forged prophecy. Thus the preparing of the way of the Lord (Yahweh) shifts to a Messianic interpretation and the make straight his paths is substituted for the paths of our God.
I think that TGBaker oversteps yet again. If you look at many Old Testament quotations in the New Testament you will find that they differ when you look up the corresponding passages. Why? The answer is because the writers of the New Testament used the Septuagint - the Greek Translations at the time of the 1st Century AD. Few Jews at the time read Hebrew but Greek was the common language. Most of our new translations of the Old Testament are based on the Hebrew texts - therefore they are going to read a little different,. I disagree that means that the New Testament is based on false prophecies because I think you have to agree that the Jews who made the Septuagint knew how to translate Hebrew into Greek better than most people alive today. If anything it improves the reliability of our texts. Having the Septuagint gives us even more data to understand the New Testament manuscripts and how idioms and words were used in the First Cenutry! Praise God for such a gift!
Debunking Christianity: Jesus Was Baptized for His Sins
I would like to present an atheistic bible study, an observation or interpretation, I believe explains the re-working of the original story of Jesus and John the Baptist by the authors of Matthew and Luke. This is with the understanding that Matthew and Luke use Mark in their compositions. In Mark Jesus is baptized into ( eis) the remission of sins. The preposition “eis” means from out of a state to into a different state or place. This preposition in Mark is redacted (re-worked or edited) by Matthew.
"Observation" and "interpretation" are not synonymous. The thought that Matthew and Luke use Mark in their compositions is still only a theory, but let's leave that aside for the time being. Only a point that is in the text can be observed and any interpretation can be shoehorned into any text. First the observation that "eis" is used in the narrative in Mark describing Jesus' baptism. Let's look at Mark. No text reference is given but it seems that he is referring to the following:
9 At that time Jesus came from Nazareth in Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan. - Mark 1:9 (NIV)
However the author seems to want to translate this verse to say that Jesus was baptized to get rid of his sin. But I can't find a single English translation that agree with this author. What about Matthew?
13 Then Jesus came from Galilee to the Jordan to be baptized by John. - Matthew 3:13 (NIV)
Hmmm...reads the same in English. Let's see if he's right about the Greek texts?
Τότε παραγίνεται ὁ Ἰησοῦς ἀπὸ τῆς Γαλιλαίας ἐπὶ τὸν Ἰορδάνην πρὸς τὸν Ἰωάννην τοῦ βαπτισθῆναι ὑπ' αὐτοῦ. - Matthew 3:13
Καὶ ἐγένετο ἐν ἐκείναις ταῖς ἡμέραις ἦλθεν Ἰησοῦς ἀπὸ Ναζαρὲτ τῆς Γαλιλαίας καὶ ἐβαπτίσθη εἰς τὸν Ἰορδάνην ὑπὸ Ἰωάννου. Mark 1:9
The statement of what the baptism is for in Matthew is dropped. We see the term "into the remission of sins' added instead by Matthew to the pericope of the Last Supper. 26:28. There communion becomes for the remission of sin. Matthew creates a conversation where John the Baptist tries to prevent Jesus from being baptized and Jesus tells him to go on with it to fulfill all righteousness.
I would like to know which manuscripts TGBaker is getting this from. The Phrase "into the remission of sins" is not in Mark 1:9.. And none of the canonical Gospels show Jesus getting baptized more than once. In addition I see fundamental mistake here in that neither Communion nor Baptism save you or takes away your sins. These are only symbolic of the work God does in the hearts and minds of His people. There is not a single passage in the Bible that make salvation contingent on Communion or Baptism. Also I see a lot of "poisoning the well" here. Why would TGBaker insinuate that Matthew manufactures the conversation between Jesus and John the Baptist? Why couldn't Matthew just have a detail that Mark does not? TGBaker has presumptions that the texts cannot be reliable and he spins his interpretation in what ever way he has to validate those assumptions.
This answers the problem of why a sinless person would need baptism as in Mark and also makes John subservient to Jesus. This makes obvious the church is dealing with the fact that Jesus was a follower of John the Baptist and does not begin his ministry until John is arrested. The author of the Gospel of John will have Jesus baptizing and ministering at the same time as the Baptist and does not have Jesus baptized by John.
Another presumptions offered with no proof of any kind. There is the theory going around that Jesus was one of John the Baptist's followers, but no proof is ever seeming given beyond raising the speculation. John and Mark are not in conflict because John does not say that Jesus was not baptized by John the Baptist.all. Mark said that Jesus went into Galilee after John was arrested not that he did no ministry before John the Baptist was arrested. Sure wish people would not read things into the Bible that is not there.
In Mark Jesus comes up out of the water and the Holy Spirit comes into ( again eis) him. Matthew changes this to the spirit descends upon ( epi) him. The idea of the spirit after baptism coming into a person is consistent with the idea in Acts 2:38: Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Again the message was not that Baptism was the prerequisite for forgiveness of sin. Baptism is a sign of repentance. I sure would like to know what translation this guy is using because I can't find an English translation that agrees with him.
In Mark Jesus alone hears god saying that he is well pleased. In Matthew god addresses his pleasure to the crowds. Luke maintains Mark's terminology about baptism, changes the adoptionistic reception of the Spirit into Jesus to a confirmation like Matthew to the spirit as dove comes down upon (epi) him. The change of the preposition by Matthew and Luke are intentional because of the theological implications and the addition of the infancy narratives wherein Jesus has the spirit from birth! Luke quotes mark and maintains gods announcement of pleasure to Jesus.
Um, Luke did not say that Jesus has the spirit from Birth. It says that John the Baptist did. Just because Mark does not have the detail that other people heard the voice and understood the sign at Jesus' baptism does not mean the Luke made it up. Notice that Mark does not say that only Jesus saw the dove and heard the voice. The voice was for the crowd's benefit not Jesus' benefit.
When one looks at the quoted OT verses in Mark 1:2f they are combined and perhaps reflect a pre-exiting proof text designed from Isaiah and Malachi not just Isaiah as stated. The pronouns are changed so that the verses can apply to the idea of the Baptist as precursor. Instead of "Behold I send my messenger before your face the original in Malachi 3:1 reads "I will send my messenger before me ( i.e.; God)." The change is from god talking to his prophet about his own coming to god talking to Christ about sending the Baptist before him. The messenger in Malachi was originally the Messiah and not the Baptist. The change is from god to messiah or Jesus in doing so and an example of a forged prophecy. Thus the preparing of the way of the Lord (Yahweh) shifts to a Messianic interpretation and the make straight his paths is substituted for the paths of our God.
I think that TGBaker oversteps yet again. If you look at many Old Testament quotations in the New Testament you will find that they differ when you look up the corresponding passages. Why? The answer is because the writers of the New Testament used the Septuagint - the Greek Translations at the time of the 1st Century AD. Few Jews at the time read Hebrew but Greek was the common language. Most of our new translations of the Old Testament are based on the Hebrew texts - therefore they are going to read a little different,. I disagree that means that the New Testament is based on false prophecies because I think you have to agree that the Jews who made the Septuagint knew how to translate Hebrew into Greek better than most people alive today. If anything it improves the reliability of our texts. Having the Septuagint gives us even more data to understand the New Testament manuscripts and how idioms and words were used in the First Cenutry! Praise God for such a gift!
Debunking Christianity: Jesus Was Baptized for His Sins
Monday, June 6, 2011
The Bible and Evolution | Dr. Claude Mariottini – Professor of Old Testament
Dr Claude Mariottini has posted an interesting article on a book that discusses the way to understand how science and evolution should be thought of together. The book is called Science, Creation and the Bible: Reconciling Rival Theories of Origin (Downers Grove: IVP Academic, 2010). Follow the link below to read Dr Mariottini's post about the book.
The Bible and Evolution | Dr. Claude Mariottini – Professor of Old Testament
The Bible and Evolution | Dr. Claude Mariottini – Professor of Old Testament
Related articles
- [書摘] Book Summary and Review: Themes and the transformations in Old Testament prophecy (breath35.wordpress.com)
- How did the Bible first originate (wiki.answers.com)
Answering Muslims: Muslim "Activist" Salwa Al-Mutairi Calls for Legalized Sex Slavery
Is this really the kind of world we want?
I know that some who think morality is relative might argue that it is okay because it's their culture. I disagree. Adultery is wrong no matter who does it and women are not mere sexual objects to be exploited. I would not want such a life for my daughter, cousin, or any woman. It just is not right. I'm glad David Wood pointed this out and also points to the fact that it is consistent with Islamic culture.
Answering Muslims: Muslim "Activist" Salwa Al-Mutairi Calls for Legalized Sex Slavery
KUWAIT: A female political activist and former parliamentary candidate has recommended the introduction of legislation to legalize the provision of enslaved female concubines for Muslim men in Kuwait in a bid, she says, to protect those men from committing adultery or corruption.
I know that some who think morality is relative might argue that it is okay because it's their culture. I disagree. Adultery is wrong no matter who does it and women are not mere sexual objects to be exploited. I would not want such a life for my daughter, cousin, or any woman. It just is not right. I'm glad David Wood pointed this out and also points to the fact that it is consistent with Islamic culture.
Qur’an 23:1-6—The believers must (eventually) win through—those who humble themselves in their prayers; who avoid vain talk; who are active in deeds of charity; who abstain from sex, except with those joined to them in the marriage bond, or (the captives) whom their right hands possess—for (in their case) they are free from blame.
Qur’an 4:24—Also (forbidden are) women already married, except those (captives and slaves) whom your right hands possess.
She suggested that special offices could be set up to provide concubines in the same way as domestic staff recruitment agencies currently provide housemaids.
We want our youth to be protected from adultery," said Al-Mutairi, suggesting that these maids could be brought as prisoners of war in war-stricken nations like Chechnya to be sold on later to devout merchants.
This is not religiously forbidden," she added, indicating that Caliph Haroun Al-Rashid (766-809 AD) was married to one woman but possessed 200 concubines. (Source)
Answering Muslims: Muslim "Activist" Salwa Al-Mutairi Calls for Legalized Sex Slavery
Related articles
- "Men should have sex slaves" (arunwithaview.wordpress.com)
- Saudi judge seeks doc to sever spinal cord as sharia punishment (creepingsharia.wordpress.com)
- Adultery (maldivianapostates.wordpress.com)
- Sexual Slavery of Women in Islam (samhindu.wordpress.com)
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FacePalm of the Day #85 - Debunking Christianity: Christology Rests Upon a Mistake
There has been guest post on Debunking Christianity that needs a response because it rest on a fundamental assertion that can't be substantiated
The author attacks the fundamental truth that Jesus' life, sacrifice, and redemption is the means of salvation from sin and death by arguing that the story of Genesis is wrong because there was no Adam and no original sin. The author concludes that there is no need of propitiation because there is no original sin. I see two problems with his line of reasoning: 1. If sin is defined as the propensity and inability to obey God and live up to the standards God has set for us then our need for salvation really hasn't much to do with Adam or Eve because each and everyone of us have more than enough sin to deserve punishment on our own without even looking at Adam or Eve, 2. Who says that Genesis is incorrect?
I don't think that Adam and Eve are mythological at all. Is the earth billions of years old? Yup. Does the Bible say it's not billions of years old? Nope. I suggest that anyone has a problem with the order of Creation or the meaning of "Yom:" - translated "days" - they should look up the work of Dr Hugh Ross and his ministry at Reasons to Believe. I've posted a few resources from him on this blog here. I don't agree with everything but I think he is right that the Earth is extremely more than 6000 years old and I think he gives good reasons for thinking it from science and scripture. As for Original Sin, given that the Bible does not give us enough information to figure out how long ago Creation, Eden, and Noah's Ark happened, but that does not mean that they didn't happen.
Every honest person has to admit that we are sinners. We have all told at least one lie. We have all failed to live up to what is right. We have hurt other people. We have not done all the good we could have done. Do we really think that we can just ignore that? Do we really think we are not accountable for the evil we have done? Do we really think that we don't owe? Do we not deserve judgment? We also have to agree that we have done wrong some of those times not intending to do it and sometimes it was voluntary.
Without Jesus what do you have? What is your propitiation? I agree that Jesus did indeed die for His teachings. What did Jesus teach? Jesus said:
Also let us not forget that when the angel Gabriel announced Jesus' birth to His mother Mary, Jesus' purpose is clearly spelled out!
Without Jesus you are in your sins! Come to Him so you can be acquitted and avoid the punishments you deserve. You won't be declared "Innocent" but "Not Guilty!" That is the meaning of propitiation.
Debunking Christianity: Christology Rests Upon a Mistake
Christology rests upon a mistake. This is a simple statement that could be easily understood by much of the various Christian denominations. As so it means the invalidity of the Christian Faith since it rests upon its own Christology.
Christology or how and why Jesus saves is based upon the idea that the Genesis account of Creation is real. However, much of Christendom apart from conservative evangelicals and fundamentalists knows how the universe began and that evolution is factual. They also affirm that the Genesis account of the Creation and Adam and Eve are mythological. It is unlikely for example that plants were created a day before the sun, moon and stars as in presented in Genesis. Also there is plenty of fossil and genetic evidence that humankind has been about hundreds of thousands of years.
Since the Creation and the Fall are mythological and not literal accounts there is no basis to assume there is original sin. Christology is based upon original sin. The death of Jesus upon the cross is a sacrifice (propitiation) for that sin. Paul argues it, “As in Adam all have sinned and died so in Christ all are made alive.” Since there was no Adam, Eve, Eden, or Fall then there is no basis for a need of salvation. Jesus did not die for your sins. He died because of his teachings.
The author attacks the fundamental truth that Jesus' life, sacrifice, and redemption is the means of salvation from sin and death by arguing that the story of Genesis is wrong because there was no Adam and no original sin. The author concludes that there is no need of propitiation because there is no original sin. I see two problems with his line of reasoning: 1. If sin is defined as the propensity and inability to obey God and live up to the standards God has set for us then our need for salvation really hasn't much to do with Adam or Eve because each and everyone of us have more than enough sin to deserve punishment on our own without even looking at Adam or Eve, 2. Who says that Genesis is incorrect?
I don't think that Adam and Eve are mythological at all. Is the earth billions of years old? Yup. Does the Bible say it's not billions of years old? Nope. I suggest that anyone has a problem with the order of Creation or the meaning of "Yom:" - translated "days" - they should look up the work of Dr Hugh Ross and his ministry at Reasons to Believe. I've posted a few resources from him on this blog here. I don't agree with everything but I think he is right that the Earth is extremely more than 6000 years old and I think he gives good reasons for thinking it from science and scripture. As for Original Sin, given that the Bible does not give us enough information to figure out how long ago Creation, Eden, and Noah's Ark happened, but that does not mean that they didn't happen.
Every honest person has to admit that we are sinners. We have all told at least one lie. We have all failed to live up to what is right. We have hurt other people. We have not done all the good we could have done. Do we really think that we can just ignore that? Do we really think we are not accountable for the evil we have done? Do we really think that we don't owe? Do we not deserve judgment? We also have to agree that we have done wrong some of those times not intending to do it and sometimes it was voluntary.
21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.- Romans 7:21-25
Without Jesus what do you have? What is your propitiation? I agree that Jesus did indeed die for His teachings. What did Jesus teach? Jesus said:
I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins.” - John 8:24
25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die; 26 and whoever lives by believing in me will never die. Do you believe this?” - John 11:25-26
32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.” 33 He said this to show the kind of death he was going to die.- John 12:32-33
Also let us not forget that when the angel Gabriel announced Jesus' birth to His mother Mary, Jesus' purpose is clearly spelled out!
35 The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God. 36 Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be unable to conceive is in her sixth month. 37 For no word from God will ever fail.” - Luke 1:35-37
Without Jesus you are in your sins! Come to Him so you can be acquitted and avoid the punishments you deserve. You won't be declared "Innocent" but "Not Guilty!" That is the meaning of propitiation.
5 Moses writes this about the righteousness that is by the law: “The person who does these things will live by them.” 6 But the righteousness that is by faith says: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’” (that is, to bring Christ down) 7 “or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8 But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.” 12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” - Romans 10:5-13
Debunking Christianity: Christology Rests Upon a Mistake
Related articles
- A Christological Question Regarding Heb. 1:4 (diglotting.com)
- Where I Stand On Christology (diglotting.com)
- Adam and Eve: the ultimate standoff between science and faith (and a contest!) (whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com)
- What is the christology of the gospels (wiki.answers.com)
- Sin, Bad, Evil, Devil, Our Reality Part I (psychetymology.wordpress.com)
- Original Sin (paulmarcelrene.wordpress.com)
- High Christology - Whence, When and Why? (diglotting.com)
Sunday, June 5, 2011
YouTube - Captain Kirk vs The Bible!
I found this video on YouTube where a clip from Star Trek is used to mock the Bible. I find it offensive as a Christian and as a Star Trek fan. Remember that episode where the Enterprise came across an old earth probe that became sentient and wanted to kill all organic life because it became imperfect. Captain Kirk beat the probe by showing it that it was imperfect and therefore should destroy itself. It's a nice bit of logic, but the video author switch the probe named "Nomad" with the Bible. Here is the video.
Where does this go wrong? Multiple logical issues because first Nomad being created by men was fallible and prone to error. The Bible has neither human origin nor is it full of errors. The video does nothing at all to prove that is the case. It presupposes this lie.
YouTube - Captian Kirk vs The Bible!
Where does this go wrong? Multiple logical issues because first Nomad being created by men was fallible and prone to error. The Bible has neither human origin nor is it full of errors. The video does nothing at all to prove that is the case. It presupposes this lie.
YouTube - Captian Kirk vs The Bible!
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I Have a Quick Question for Arminians:
Alan Kurschner has posted a great question for Arminians.
I got to admit that I really want to see an answer to this question.
I Have a Quick Question for Arminians:
Since you believe that God is all-powerful and all-loving, why does God not cause everyone to be saved? What is so all-mightily restraining his will to be able to save all people?
If you respond by saying that it is the resisting free-will of the unbeliever that impedes God to change their hearts, then why pray, "God, change the unbeliever's heart"? If God is "all-loving" as you claim, should not his love for the hell-bound be more important than him "respecting" the resisting free-will? What sort of divine love is that in your worldview?
At the end of the day, your theology results in the difference of someone becoming saved—not through God's love and power—but through a felicitous factor in the sinner.
“though they were not yet born and had done nothing either good or bad—in order that God’s purpose of election might continue, not because of works but because of him who calls" —Apostle Paul
I got to admit that I really want to see an answer to this question.
I Have a Quick Question for Arminians:
Related articles
- Why Do I (A Calvinist) Go to An Arminian Church? | Parchment and Pen (C. Michael Patton) (crosscenteredlife.wordpress.com)
- John MacArthur's Misrepresentation of Arminianism (counteringcalvinism.wordpress.com)
- Book Review: 'Christianity Versus the God of Calvin' by John H. Boyd (counteringcalvinism.wordpress.com)
- [15/30] Are you a Calvinist or an Arminian? (christopherlazo.com)
- The Prayer of the Arminian (jotslunaradventure.com)
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FacePalm of the Day #84 - Forsaking Paul for Jesus’ Sake
I came across a two part article by Caleb Wilde on his blog. In the first post, he talks about a story from Howard Thurman’s book, “Jesus and the Disinherited.” [Thurman is pictured on the left].He provides the following quote:
If you were a slave, unable and prevented to become literate yourself, if someone just read this to you in context of course you would take Thurman's grandmother's position. I don't know what my great-great-grandmother Mary thought about these passages, but I'm sure it occurred to many slaves, as it does to me, the question as to why it was important that slaves did not learn how to read? One of the reasons was that the slave masters did not want the slaves to know what Paul said about slave masters. This is what I would want to tell Thurman's grandmother.
I'm willing to bet money that the majority of slaves were not allowed to hear the whole passage. Paul is saying that slave-masters are accountable to God. God is their Master just like the slaves. Paul said that slaves should not be treated any kind of way. Notice that why slave-masters were trying to condemn slaves for wanting to be free and were rubbing the Bible in their faces, the Bible itself condemned them. Is the Bible wrong? No. Is there a need to put Jesus' teaching against Paul's and make a choice as to which one is right? No. I'm saddened for Thurmon's grandmother because some of the most grandiose and beautiful passages in the Bible were penned by Paul and she missed out on them because of a lie.
Forsaking Paul for Jesus’ Sake
The second post deals further with point Wilde tried to raise with the Thurmon's grandmother. He is making the point that for African Americans systematic theology and Biblical inerrancy and infallibility doesn't mean much to the religious experience of African Americans.
The thing that is missing from this conversation is that if you allow the Bible to speak for himself and ignore the wicked slave master bent on controlling and dominating other human beings, you can see what the Bible is really saying and that it does have an answer for our people who are and were "beaten, mistreated and abused by men who claimed to be followers of Jesus." The Bible makes it clear that these men are not followers of Christ.
I also found it amazing that Wilde quotes from the works of Dr. James Cone [pictured on the right], who is credited with starting Black Liberation Theology.
I disagree with much of Cone's work because he changes the Gospel. Of course God hates sin and racisim and sexism, but the Jesus did not die on the cross for just the oppressed but also the oppressor. Because of sin, sometimes - depending on the circumstances - you are the oppressor and sometimes you are the oppressed. No one is better or worse than the worst slave holder. We all deserve hell and if weren't for Jesus we would all be going to hell. This is what Liberation theologies twist and distort. The Bible's infallible truth are not just scholastic beauty, it is also truth good practical life that leads us to the one the Bible speaks of - all the Bible speaks of Jesus! Jesus said:
That is why I read the Bible - all of it.
Forsaking Paul for Jesus’ Sake: Part 2
During much of my boyhood I (Howard Thurman) was cared for by my grandmother, who was born a slave and lived until the Civil War on a plantation near Madison, Florida. My regular chore was to do all of the reading for my grandmother — she could neither read nor write. Two or three times a week I would read the Bible aloud to her. I was deeply impressed by the fact that she was most particular about the choice of Scripture. For instance, I might read many of the more devotional Psalms, some of Isaiah, the Gospels again and again. But the Pauline epistles, never — except, at long intervals, the thirteenth chapter of First Corinthians. My curiosity knew no bounds, but we did not question her about anything.I am sensitive on this issue being a descended of African slaves myself. Although I am several more generations removed from slavery than Howard Thurman, all African-Americans have to answer the contradiction between what the Bible says and what the white American slavemasters told us it says. The Bible is infallible, but those claiming to be following Christ are not. my maternal side, I am six generations removed from slavery and she was kept in chains because her masters were afraid of her - she had too much spirit and personal power. She was the last woman from that side who was a slave that I am blood descended from. On my father's maternal lineage, I am four generations removed from slavery. Mary Lucas was her name. She endured the hardships and suffering of slavery, even having her husband sold away from her. By the grace of God, she was reunited with her husband after the Civil War and my great-grandmother Cynthia was born after that. Mary and her husband founded a church after they were free and thanked God for their freedom. I don't know how they understood Ephesians and Colossians passages about slavery, but I could talk to them today, or Thurman's grandmother, and explain how the following scriptures were corrupted and that there is no reason to avoid reading Paul's letters in the slightest. First the passages those racist heathens butchered are:
When I was older and was half through college, I chanced to be spending a few days at home near the end of summer vacation. With a feeling of great temerity I asked her one day why it was that she would not let me read any of the Pauline letters. What she told me I shall never forget. ”During the days of slavery,” she said, “the master’s minister would occasionally hold services for the slaves. Old man McGhee was so mean that he would not let a Negro minister preach to his slaves. Always the white minister used as his text something from Paul. At least three or four times a year he used as a text: ‘Slaves, be obedient to them that are your masters …, as unto Christ.’ Then he would bless us. I promised my Maker that if I ever learned to read and if freedom ever came, I would not read that part of the Bible.’”
5 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6 Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7 Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not people, 8 because you know that the Lord will reward each one for whatever good they do, whether they are slave or free. - Ephesians 6:5-8
22 Slaves, obey your earthly masters in everything; and do it, not only when their eye is on you and to curry their favor, but with sincerity of heart and reverence for the Lord. 23 Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for human masters, 24 since you know that you will receive an inheritance from the Lord as a reward. It is the Lord Christ you are serving. 25 Anyone who does wrong will be repaid for their wrongs, and there is no favoritism. - Colossians 3:22-24
If you were a slave, unable and prevented to become literate yourself, if someone just read this to you in context of course you would take Thurman's grandmother's position. I don't know what my great-great-grandmother Mary thought about these passages, but I'm sure it occurred to many slaves, as it does to me, the question as to why it was important that slaves did not learn how to read? One of the reasons was that the slave masters did not want the slaves to know what Paul said about slave masters. This is what I would want to tell Thurman's grandmother.
1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. 2 “Honor your father and mother”—which is the first commandment with a promise— 3 “so that it may go well with you and that you may enjoy long life on the earth.”
4 Fathers, do not exasperate your children; instead, bring them up in the training and instruction of the Lord.
5 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6 Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7 Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not people, 8 because you know that the Lord will reward each one for whatever good they do, whether they are slave or free.
9 And masters, treat your slaves in the same way. Do not threaten them, since you know that he who is both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no favoritism with him. - Ephesians 6:1-9
I'm willing to bet money that the majority of slaves were not allowed to hear the whole passage. Paul is saying that slave-masters are accountable to God. God is their Master just like the slaves. Paul said that slaves should not be treated any kind of way. Notice that why slave-masters were trying to condemn slaves for wanting to be free and were rubbing the Bible in their faces, the Bible itself condemned them. Is the Bible wrong? No. Is there a need to put Jesus' teaching against Paul's and make a choice as to which one is right? No. I'm saddened for Thurmon's grandmother because some of the most grandiose and beautiful passages in the Bible were penned by Paul and she missed out on them because of a lie.
Forsaking Paul for Jesus’ Sake
The second post deals further with point Wilde tried to raise with the Thurmon's grandmother. He is making the point that for African Americans systematic theology and Biblical inerrancy and infallibility doesn't mean much to the religious experience of African Americans.
There’s a larger issue for grandma than the infallibility of the Bible. While the issue of infallibility might be one of the largest issues for us evangelicals who have labored to build up buttresses against supposed attacks from liberalism, we must remember that infallibility was our fight and not grandma’s fight.
Her struggle was against the white oppressors that tore families apart by selling black husbands and fathers to new slavemaster. Her struggle was against the stronghold that she was worth less than her white slave master. Her struggle was seeing her people beaten, mistreated and abused by men who claimed to be followers of Jesus.
The thing that is missing from this conversation is that if you allow the Bible to speak for himself and ignore the wicked slave master bent on controlling and dominating other human beings, you can see what the Bible is really saying and that it does have an answer for our people who are and were "beaten, mistreated and abused by men who claimed to be followers of Jesus." The Bible makes it clear that these men are not followers of Christ.
I also found it amazing that Wilde quotes from the works of Dr. James Cone [pictured on the right], who is credited with starting Black Liberation Theology.
James Cone (to listen to his perspective, click here) makes a relevant statement. He writes that the Black community
“have not been preoccupied with definitions of inspiration and infallibility … it is as if blacks have intuitively drawn the all-important distinction between infallibility and reliability … how it is the true and basic source for discovering the truth of Jesus Christ. For this reason there has been no crisis of biblical authority in the black community” (102).Cone’s distinction is helpful for those who find themselves wanting to talk back to grandma, as it helps us remember that she wasn’t reading the Bible to find all of its infallible truths so that she could arrange them in a systematic array of scholastical beauty; no, she was reading the Bible so that she could be lead closer to the One the Bible speaks of: Jesus.
I disagree with much of Cone's work because he changes the Gospel. Of course God hates sin and racisim and sexism, but the Jesus did not die on the cross for just the oppressed but also the oppressor. Because of sin, sometimes - depending on the circumstances - you are the oppressor and sometimes you are the oppressed. No one is better or worse than the worst slave holder. We all deserve hell and if weren't for Jesus we would all be going to hell. This is what Liberation theologies twist and distort. The Bible's infallible truth are not just scholastic beauty, it is also truth good practical life that leads us to the one the Bible speaks of - all the Bible speaks of Jesus! Jesus said:
"You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me," - John 5:39
That is why I read the Bible - all of it.
Forsaking Paul for Jesus’ Sake: Part 2
Related articles
- How the Bible was used to justify slavery, abolitionism (releasingreligion.blogspot.com)
- First Nazis, Now Confederates: Tarantino's Slave Movie (andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com)
- Would somebody please explain why so many black people in America convert to Islam? (barenakedislam.wordpress.com)
Debunking Christianity: PZ Myers and the Courtier's Reply Again
Here is a quote from a recent post from John Loftus:
Sometimes John Loftus says things that make a lot of sense. Often it seems he gives with one-hand (the first paragraph) and takes away with two (the second paragraph). Science really does not provide any evidence or facts that require one to come into conflict with anything in the Bible. Atheist usually choose to see evolution and Genesis as by necessity being in conflict. This isn't true. The Bible gives us no information that disagrees with the age and timescales arrived at through science. Nor does the Bible gives any alternate timeline. As for macro evolution - all living things having a single common ancestor, neither the Bible or Science support that conclusion no matter how many transitional fossils they think they find. DNA Evidence doesn't work either because there hasn't been an example of a positive mutation that resulted from a gain of information - only loss. Loftus has been trying to validate that there is something wrong with the Bible instead of himself. This isn't the case. The problem is us. Not God. We know the correct standard by which we should live but either cannot or refuse to accept those standards. Being a Christian does mean bowing the knee before God and admitting our sin and our inability to reach those standards without His help. If you are unwilling to do that you are not born-again and never has been. Science is not a problem for the Bible, but sin is the problem for us. 3
Debunking Christianity: PZ Myers and the Courtier's Reply Again
There are different types of critiques of Christianity. Each one of them stresses something different coming from different areas of expertise. Some of the major areas of criticism come from 1) The sciences, especially evolution and brain science; 2) Biblical and historical criticism; 3) Philosophy, especially the philosophy of religion; 4) Archaeology; 5) Cultural anthropology; 6) Psychology; and, 7) Social and moral criticism of the Bible and the church. There are others. What atheists think is a more effective criticism is not always the same as what Christians think is more effective.
I suspect we won't all agree. Without the sciences (#1) we probably don't have much of a critique at all, at least no reasonable alternative to a creator God, so that has got to be the highest on the list. But here's the problem. Christians denigrate the sciences in favor of their holy book. In every era Christian believers have repeatedly said that reason must bow down before faith, you see. That's the problem when using the sciences in getting Christian believers to change their minds. We must first help believers see that their holy book has holes in it. To do that we must speak to them in their language by critiquing their beliefs in terms they will understand and appreciate. Otherwise we're preaching to the choir.
Sometimes John Loftus says things that make a lot of sense. Often it seems he gives with one-hand (the first paragraph) and takes away with two (the second paragraph). Science really does not provide any evidence or facts that require one to come into conflict with anything in the Bible. Atheist usually choose to see evolution and Genesis as by necessity being in conflict. This isn't true. The Bible gives us no information that disagrees with the age and timescales arrived at through science. Nor does the Bible gives any alternate timeline. As for macro evolution - all living things having a single common ancestor, neither the Bible or Science support that conclusion no matter how many transitional fossils they think they find. DNA Evidence doesn't work either because there hasn't been an example of a positive mutation that resulted from a gain of information - only loss. Loftus has been trying to validate that there is something wrong with the Bible instead of himself. This isn't the case. The problem is us. Not God. We know the correct standard by which we should live but either cannot or refuse to accept those standards. Being a Christian does mean bowing the knee before God and admitting our sin and our inability to reach those standards without His help. If you are unwilling to do that you are not born-again and never has been. Science is not a problem for the Bible, but sin is the problem for us. 3
Debunking Christianity: PZ Myers and the Courtier's Reply Again
Related articles
- Who says we don't need bible scholars? (scienceblogs.com)
Saturday, June 4, 2011
Hope the Birthers Don't See This One!!!
Let's hope the Birthers don't next accuse President Obama of being born on.....Vulcan!
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- Trump dings Cantor, reprises birther talk (politico.com)
FacePalm of the Day #83 - Debunking Christianity: DC is Alive and Kicking, Speaking to Both Sides!
John Lofus has posted a very strange post to me.
I congratulate him on the success of his blog and his many readers. However, I do not understand how he claims to be haven where people from both sides can "visit and discuss ideas that separates us." It seems to me that you only get to freely express your ideas if you agree with the athiests and Loftus himself who read the site. You're called a "troll" or worse for just stopping by and disagreeing.
Here is a concrete example:
I was engaged in a discussing on the following post: American Adults Are Leaving Christianity At 4x's the Rate They're Joining. The Original comment was:
It was with respect to the fact that both of these individuals and others in the same thread said things about the Bible that just simply is not true. Of course suggesting that more rigorous study was needed really rubbed people in the thread the wrong way. This lead Loftus to post the following: Quote of the Day by a Christian Named Marcus McElhaney. In why he bolded the part about "studying harder" and proceeded to ignore the context in which I was responding. In addition saying that I think they have to agree with me on every single point in order to correctly understand the Bible. He and other on that site really are a cheerleading session for atheism and have no desire to seriously talk to other who disagree with their presuppositions and conclusion. It is much easier to believe that Christians are deluded instead of seriously considering if they are not the ones being deluded.
JP Holding was kind enough to weigh in on that particular post also: Debunking Loftus: Setting John Straight: Maybe He Needs an Outsider Test?
Given the interview Loftus recently gave, I'd have to question exactly his honesty in his apostasy.
Debunking Christianity: DC is Aliv - e and Kicking, Speaking to Both Sides!
Thanks to all my regular readers and commenters for making DC what it is. It's rare to achieve what I have attempted. This blog is not one that preaches to the choir. I am not a cheerleader for anything atheist. There are too many sites that do that in an endless cycle of seeing who can best stick it to Christians. And, as you would guess, I'm no cheerleader for Christianity either, to say the least. ;-) But both sides visit here to discuss the ideas that separate us, including SBL's Bibliobloggers, where DC ranks above 5th place every month (out of 500+ sites). Yes, I get attacked at times from both sides in my attempt to reach out to Christians. But I am passionate to change the religious landscape in ways I think are best given my talents. Cheers.
I congratulate him on the success of his blog and his many readers. However, I do not understand how he claims to be haven where people from both sides can "visit and discuss ideas that separates us." It seems to me that you only get to freely express your ideas if you agree with the athiests and Loftus himself who read the site. You're called a "troll" or worse for just stopping by and disagreeing.
Here is a concrete example:
I was engaged in a discussing on the following post: American Adults Are Leaving Christianity At 4x's the Rate They're Joining. The Original comment was:
Emory and Greg
I concede that the Bible is indeed confusing...to both of you! Other people don't agree with you Greg's thoughts on how confusing the Bible is. Maybe you just need to study harder.
It was with respect to the fact that both of these individuals and others in the same thread said things about the Bible that just simply is not true. Of course suggesting that more rigorous study was needed really rubbed people in the thread the wrong way. This lead Loftus to post the following: Quote of the Day by a Christian Named Marcus McElhaney. In why he bolded the part about "studying harder" and proceeded to ignore the context in which I was responding. In addition saying that I think they have to agree with me on every single point in order to correctly understand the Bible. He and other on that site really are a cheerleading session for atheism and have no desire to seriously talk to other who disagree with their presuppositions and conclusion. It is much easier to believe that Christians are deluded instead of seriously considering if they are not the ones being deluded.
JP Holding was kind enough to weigh in on that particular post also: Debunking Loftus: Setting John Straight: Maybe He Needs an Outsider Test?
Given the interview Loftus recently gave, I'd have to question exactly his honesty in his apostasy.
Debunking Christianity: DC is Aliv - e and Kicking, Speaking to Both Sides!
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Answering Muslims: Where Did Jesus Say, "I Am God, Worship Me"?
One of the big contentions between Islam and Christianity is regarding Jesus' deity and the Trinity. David Wood has posted a really good article that answers the popular polemic many Muslims use against Christians: "Where Did Jesus Say, 'I AM God, Worship Me!'?" The article affirms Jesus' identity using Scripture and how to understand the arguments from an Islamic perspective.
Answering Muslims: Where Did Jesus Say, "I Am God, Worship Me"?
Answering Muslims: Where Did Jesus Say, "I Am God, Worship Me"?
Related articles
- My Biblical Answer To The Islamic Ads Calling "Jesus A Prophet Of Islam" Bible Proof Jesus Christ Is God! (soulrefuge.org)
- Jesus a Prophet of Islam ??? (2012patriot.wordpress.com)
- Heaven, Hell, and who goes where (wonderingpreacher.wordpress.com)
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Beggars All: Reformation And Apologetics: Catholic Answers: Martin Luther and the Deuterocanonicals
Beggars All: Reformation And Apologetics: Catholic Answers: Martin Luther and the Deuterocanonicals
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- How did Martin Luther's ideas conflict with those of the Roman Catholic Church (wiki.answers.com)
- Did Martin Luther inspire the Nazi's ? (politics.ie)
- What religion did Martin Luther belong (wiki.answers.com)
- Bishop Harry Jackson Believes Scripture Is Why Martin Luther King, Jr. Would Be Against Gay Marriage (pinkbananaworld.com)
Infrographic: The U. S. Maternal Health Care Crisis Numbers You… | The Angry Black Woman
Infrographic: The U. S. Maternal Health Care Crisis Numbers You… | The Angry Black Woman
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- Black Women: Most Likely to Die From Childbirth Complications (theroot.com)
- Moms Should Maximize Maternity Leave And Breastfeed Says New Study (medicalnewstoday.com)
Fallacy Friday: Affirming the Consequent - Apologetics 315
This week, Matthew Flannagan and Brian Auten tackled the logical fallacy called "Affirming the Consequent".
Fallacy Friday: Affirming the Consequent - Apologetics 315
Fallacy Friday: Affirming the Consequent - Apologetics 315
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